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 A Report from Terri Schiavo's Room 
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Viking Kong
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Richard Tull wrote:
As far as the subject goes, unfortunately this is going to have an unhappy ending no matter which way it goes. It's really sad....
Agreed.

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Thu Mar 31, 2005 12:38 am
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Godzilla
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Sandman wrote:
I'm sorry, but I think too many doctors have a god complex.
Scratch that comment. In the context of your comment, I don’t mean to say that about our friend TheSurgeon. I don't have a dislike of doctors.

I've been frustrated with this Terri Schiavo case in that you hear doctors giving opinions that are diametrically opposed. And then the public argues about who's right. It makes me wonder how much we can rely on the opinions of so-called experts in cases like this. Doctors can be hired to say almost anything in court. So who is the public to believe? I’m getting cynical.

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Thu Mar 31, 2005 12:39 am
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Dr. X
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Sandman wrote:
I'm not diminishing their knowledge and skills, but they aren't immune to mistakes in judgment.


Good point. I'm not saying which side I'm on (that's my business) but I will say if it keeps my heart and lungs going, brain dead or not, make me look like a freakin' pin cushion!


Thu Mar 31, 2005 12:43 am
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Sandman wrote:
Sandman wrote:
I'm sorry, but I think too many doctors have a god complex.
Scratch that comment. In the context of your comment, I don’t mean to say that about our friend TheSurgeon. I don't have a dislike of doctors.

I've been frustrated with this Terri Schiavo case in that you hear doctors giving opinions that are diametrically opposed. And then the public argues about who's right. It makes me wonder how much we can rely on the opinions of so-called experts in cases like this. Doctors can be hired to say almost anything in court. So who is the public to believe? I’m getting cynical.


The point I was making was that the "prominent atheist" is shooting his mouth off about things he knows nothing about. He's not a doctor and he's making statements that are 100% wrong about the known physiology of what happens when the human body is deprived of fluid intake.

I have seen many patients die, from many causes. I have obviously never experienced any form of death personally. Hence any judgment that I make about how "peaceful" a particular death is based on my knowledge of the underlying physiology and my observation of the patient. Patients who die as a result of withdrawal of tube feeding do not show any external signs of pain or discomfort. They gradually become less alert and then lose consciousness and then eventually stop breathing. If it is appropriate to call any death "peaceful", I believe such a death qualifies. That is my opinion.

But that article, which implied rupturing organs and agonizing pain, is completely bogus. No physician on either side of this debate would agree with his statements. It is not a matter of differing opinion or a judgment call. It is pure misstatement of fact.

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Thu Mar 31, 2005 2:59 am
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Viking Kong
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Well, she's dead now. 14 days. :cry:

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Thu Mar 31, 2005 3:00 pm
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I just heard more about her death.....This guy is a FUCKER. If this was my daughter, I 'd kick this fuckers ass.


He's going to creamate Terry (a Catholic). Catholics are rarely creamated.

He's going to bury her in Philidelphia, when she lived in FL and her parents live in FL.

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Thu Mar 31, 2005 4:11 pm
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Superhero
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RIP

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Thu Mar 31, 2005 4:14 pm
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is O.H.B.
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RIP Terri :cry:


Thu Mar 31, 2005 4:26 pm
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God Of The Sun

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KenHower wrote:
I just heard more about her death.....This guy is a FUCKER. If this was my daughter, I 'd kick this fuckers ass.


He's going to creamate Terry (a Catholic). Catholics are rarely creamated.

He's going to bury her in Philidelphia, when she lived in FL and her parents live in FL.


Cremation is accepted now. My Grandmother checked with the Church while setting up her and my Grandfather's eventual passing. It is not preferred, though.

I am relieved that any suffering Terri was experiencing is over, whether is was trapped in her vegatative body or starvation.


Thu Mar 31, 2005 5:13 pm
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Godzilla

Joined: Mon Nov 18, 2002 12:10 pm
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Sandman wrote:
Sandman wrote:
I'm sorry, but I think too many doctors have a god complex.
Scratch that comment. In the context of your comment, I don’t mean to say that about our friend TheSurgeon. I don't have a dislike of doctors.

I've been frustrated with this Terri Schiavo case in that you hear doctors giving opinions that are diametrically opposed. And then the public argues about who's right. It makes me wonder how much we can rely on the opinions of so-called experts in cases like this. Doctors can be hired to say almost anything in court. So who is the public to believe? I’m getting cynical.


The ones who were giving the opinions that there WAS hope for Terri's recover were quacks. At least the one who claimed to be a Nobel Prize "nominee".
The doctors who actually physically examined Terri agreed.

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Thu Mar 31, 2005 6:11 pm
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Godzilla

Joined: Mon Nov 18, 2002 12:10 pm
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KenHower wrote:
I just heard more about her death.....This guy is a FUCKER. If this was my daughter, I 'd kick this fuckers ass.


He's going to creamate Terry (a Catholic). Catholics are rarely creamated.

He's going to bury her in Philidelphia, when she lived in FL and her parents live in FL.


Easy now, Ken.

You keep condemning this man when you know very little about him. Remember, the news is primarily hype and thrives on controversy.

He's her husband, btw.. He has EVERY RIGHT to make WHATEVER arrangements he feels are appropriate. It's not our place to judge him.

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Thu Mar 31, 2005 6:15 pm
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Godzilla

Joined: Mon Nov 18, 2002 12:10 pm
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TheSurgeon wrote:
Sandman wrote:
Sandman wrote:
I'm sorry, but I think too many doctors have a god complex.
Scratch that comment. In the context of your comment, I don’t mean to say that about our friend TheSurgeon. I don't have a dislike of doctors.

I've been frustrated with this Terri Schiavo case in that you hear doctors giving opinions that are diametrically opposed. And then the public argues about who's right. It makes me wonder how much we can rely on the opinions of so-called experts in cases like this. Doctors can be hired to say almost anything in court. So who is the public to believe? I’m getting cynical.


The point I was making was that the "prominent atheist" is shooting his mouth off about things he knows nothing about. He's not a doctor and he's making statements that are 100% wrong about the known physiology of what happens when the human body is deprived of fluid intake.

I have seen many patients die, from many causes. I have obviously never experienced any form of death personally. Hence any judgment that I make about how "peaceful" a particular death is based on my knowledge of the underlying physiology and my observation of the patient. Patients who die as a result of withdrawal of tube feeding do not show any external signs of pain or discomfort. They gradually become less alert and then lose consciousness and then eventually stop breathing. If it is appropriate to call any death "peaceful", I believe such a death qualifies. That is my opinion.

But that article, which implied rupturing organs and agonizing pain, is completely bogus. No physician on either side of this debate would agree with his statements. It is not a matter of differing opinion or a judgment call. It is pure misstatement of fact.


Thank you for your expert opinion..

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Thu Mar 31, 2005 6:17 pm
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Viking Kong
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GTRMAN wrote:
KenHower wrote:
I just heard more about her death.....This guy is a FUCKER. If this was my daughter, I 'd kick this fuckers ass.


He's going to creamate Terry (a Catholic). Catholics are rarely creamated.

He's going to bury her in Philidelphia, when she lived in FL and her parents live in FL.


Easy now, Ken.

You keep condemning this man when you know very little about him. Remember, the news is primarily hype and thrives on controversy.

He's her husband, btw.. He has EVERY RIGHT to make WHATEVER arrangements he feels are appropriate. It's not our place to judge him.


You're right, as long as he says "It's what Terri would have wanted." That's what got him this far anyway, isn't it?

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Thu Mar 31, 2005 7:21 pm
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Viking Kong
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:lol: Ryan's pimp-hand, like the penguin's, is strong! :lol:

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Thu Mar 31, 2005 7:26 pm
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Godzilla

Joined: Mon Nov 18, 2002 12:10 pm
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Ryan wrote:
GTRMAN wrote:
KenHower wrote:
I just heard more about her death.....This guy is a FUCKER. If this was my daughter, I 'd kick this fuckers ass.


He's going to creamate Terry (a Catholic). Catholics are rarely creamated.

He's going to bury her in Philidelphia, when she lived in FL and her parents live in FL.


Easy now, Ken.

You keep condemning this man when you know very little about him. Remember, the news is primarily hype and thrives on controversy.

He's her husband, btw.. He has EVERY RIGHT to make WHATEVER arrangements he feels are appropriate. It's not our place to judge him.


You're right, as long as he says "It's what Terri would have wanted." That's what got him this far anyway, isn't it?


He knew her better than anyone else. It's also his right as a husband.

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Thu Mar 31, 2005 7:36 pm
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Superhero
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Joined: Mon Jun 30, 2003 6:50 pm
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GTRMAN wrote:
Ryan wrote:
GTRMAN wrote:
KenHower wrote:
I just heard more about her death.....This guy is a FUCKER. If this was my daughter, I 'd kick this fuckers ass.


He's going to creamate Terry (a Catholic). Catholics are rarely creamated.

He's going to bury her in Philidelphia, when she lived in FL and her parents live in FL.


Easy now, Ken.

You keep condemning this man when you know very little about him. Remember, the news is primarily hype and thrives on controversy.

He's her husband, btw.. He has EVERY RIGHT to make WHATEVER arrangements he feels are appropriate. It's not our place to judge him.


You're right, as long as he says "It's what Terri would have wanted." That's what got him this far anyway, isn't it?


He knew her better than anyone else. It's also his right as a husband.


sorry dude, but i disagree with you on almost everything you say. argh


Thu Mar 31, 2005 8:10 pm
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Godzilla

Joined: Mon Nov 18, 2002 12:10 pm
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SRV463 wrote:
GTRMAN wrote:
Ryan wrote:
GTRMAN wrote:
KenHower wrote:
I just heard more about her death.....This guy is a FUCKER. If this was my daughter, I 'd kick this fuckers ass.


He's going to creamate Terry (a Catholic). Catholics are rarely creamated.

He's going to bury her in Philidelphia, when she lived in FL and her parents live in FL.


Easy now, Ken.

You keep condemning this man when you know very little about him. Remember, the news is primarily hype and thrives on controversy.

He's her husband, btw.. He has EVERY RIGHT to make WHATEVER arrangements he feels are appropriate. It's not our place to judge him.


You're right, as long as he says "It's what Terri would have wanted." That's what got him this far anyway, isn't it?


He knew her better than anyone else. It's also his right as a husband.


sorry dude, but i disagree with you on almost everything you say. argh


It's not his right? The courts disagreed.

He was her husband. I'm sure he knew things about her that NOBODY else knew. Even her parents.

Besides, how does your disagreeing with me invalidate my statements in any way?

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Thu Mar 31, 2005 8:38 pm
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Godzilla
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TheSurgeon wrote:
But that article, which implied rupturing organs and agonizing pain, is completely bogus. No physician on either side of this debate would agree with his statements. It is not a matter of differing opinion or a judgment call. It is pure misstatement of fact.

I can respect that as a reasoned opinion.

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Thu Mar 31, 2005 9:04 pm
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God Of The Sun

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My spouse knows more about me than my parents. Knowing me as an adult is different than when they raised as a child (til 26 :lol: ). More private and intimate thoughts, beliefs, etc are shared with my "better half".


Thu Mar 31, 2005 9:04 pm
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Godzilla
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A lot of original documentation on the Schiavo case: www.hospicepatients.org/terri-schindler-schiavo-docs-links-page.html

Of particular interest is testimony that Michael said Terri never expressed her wishes: Affidavit of TrudyCapone-05-09-01

A major concern I have about this case is that there doesn't appear to be adequate protections in place for a patient who has a guardian who doesn't have his or her best interests at heart, for whatever reason. A guardian is in a pretty powerful position, making life and death decisions for another person. It seems there should be some burden of evidence required of a guardian that he or she really does have the patient's best interest at heart. Otherwise, a marriage contract becomes a license to kill whenever someone's spouse becomes unable to communicate.

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Thu Mar 31, 2005 9:07 pm
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